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RBY 4U (Under3U) RMT - Stars of the Sea

Discussion in 'Public Teams' started by Peasounay, Oct 8, 2016.

  1. Peasounay

    Peasounay qui peut me stopper Host Emeritus

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    Hi, this is my 300th post :D It’s a bit of a random milestone but eh, I've been thinking about this for a while and I really wanted to write and share something about 4U, so here I do. Sorry for the lame name, I only realised I had to give one like two seconds before posting the thread, and I didn’t want to call it « best 4U team yo » so… let's go ! Thanks a lot to Sobi for the awesome GP checking.

    Introduction

    The 4U tour is over. It was a lot of fun to play in it and I realised how much I like this tier—it’s so intense and full of high pressure while still being competitive despite the heavy RNG happening sometimes. I feel like 4U doesn’t allow you to make any mistake; things can happen very fast, you constantly have to see 5 to 10 to 20 turns ahead to know where you’ll be at and where you want to be. Of course, you should be doing this in every tier and even every generation, but in 4U, it feels like chess on a smaller board. Even the stalling situations, such as Porygon dittos, end up with one player being forced out due to drops. If it’s Blastoise versus Blastoise, each player is gonna try to punish his opponent as soon as possible, and the other player will lack resources to defend himself way faster than in 1U. Having the momentum is just so important—managing to get your Nidoking out to hit more times than your opponent can build a crucial advantage towards the path to victory. Long story short: I love 4U.

    Pokemon Perfect’s vision of tiering allowed me to play such a fun tier, and other fun ones too. I guess I just want to give some of it back by sharing what I consider a good team and the thoughts behind it while maybe helping new players get into this tier. If you want to start playing lower tiers but don’t really know where to start, I hope this will help you.


    Teambuilding Process

    Before the tournament started, I played some friendly games here and there, and was for no reason in a Staryu mood. I went through my teams and realised I had almost none, as I was just spamming Slowpoke. I wanted to try Staryu a bit more. I built a few standard teams with it and they worked out well, but I still used my old Slowpoke teams in the early stages of the tournament, the same teams that helped me get a 17-4 record during the New Frontiers tour.

    Then something else happened: midway through the tour, there was what I consider a drastic change in the viability rankings—Porygon dropped to A, and at the same time, Omastar rose to A. I disagreed with the drop of Porygon but did not oppose, since everyone seemed to agree on it. I never liked dropping it because I feel it’s one of the best ways to deal with opposing Porygon (and the most reliable way to paralyse it); it’s also a very good Blastoise check when unparalysed, and it can give a hit to an incoming Nidoking trying to break it and therefore gives you the advantage in a future Nidoking ditto. It can be a wincon during late-game if your opponent doesn’t have one of his own, since it can paralyse Pokemon such as Venomoth and hit Water-types. I never liked dropping it, and I pretty much never did. I felt like the change made sense with the rise of Omastar, though, since it 2HKOes it with Hydro Pump.

    During the tour, I watched some replays to see what kind of teams other players were using, and some heavily deviated from the old Venomoth / Nidoking / Porygon / Blastoise structure and were sometimes oriented towards a heavy Water-type spam (sometimes up to three Water-types since Electric-types are non-existant). Then, happened a series between Lusch and marcoasd, where Lusch used a very innovative team without Nidoking and Porygon, but with a Seadra. I think that at this moment, in my mind, the trends connected with my rising like for Staryu, and I felt like it was a Pokemon that could somehow tackle the metagame. From there on, I decided to build a team almost completely around it, and I spent a lot of time just thinking about the tier and how to build it.

    [​IMG]

    The starting point. Despite being frail, Staryu can check other Water-types. It’s very good in the late-game, since it can corner your opponent if they lack tools to efficiently break it, and it can help you deal with Nidoking. It’s also a very good way of spreading paralysis, even if you usually Recover after switching into a Water. The reason I now tend to prefer Staryu over a Pokemon such as Slowpoke is that you can switch into Blastoise and Omastar without losing momentum, which is not always the case with Slowpoke. I also feel like players now tend to be way more agressive than during the beginning of the tier, and they punish Slowpoke better, usually with Nido while still having the tools to handle yours. Staryu can also be a desperate last resort against a Slowpoke threatening your team, but I usually prefer using Nidoking against it, as it trades but is more reliable.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Then, I added these two pretty much at the same time. As I said previously, the same way one might not like to drop Chansey in 1U, I don’t like to drop Porygon in 4U. I think it’s just such a good Pokemon. These three complement each other extremely well. Staryu + Porygon check every Water-type, so I prefer to use Porygon as my Blastoise check when it’s still unparalysed, because I don’t want to take the risk of Staryu getting paralysed by a Body Slam. Plus, if my opponent predicts Staryu and Body Slam Porygon i'm not always forced to Recover even if I have to be careful, so I have the momentum. It’s also a very good way of spreading more paralysis, which Omastar really enjoys. It can then break the crap out of Porygon to unleash yours. It is checked by other Water-types, but you take care of them with the combination of Staryu + Porygon anyway. The synergy between these three can make it difficult for your foe to break through it. The most annoying thing for this is probably Body Slam Omastar... and bad luck.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Then, I added these two brainlessely. I said I’m never dropping Porygon, I’m dropping those even less. They’re by far the two best Pokemon in the tier, I’m not gonna elaborate pointlessly about how, since most people who play this tier know it. I’ll just say that Nidoking is usually my way of handling Slowpoke, and Venomoth is obviously a perfect Tangela check, a Pokemon that can be annoying at times.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    The last fellow to this squad is Tangela. I could’ve used a Fire-type lead, it would’ve worked fine since Water-types are handled. I opted for Tangela instead for various reasons. First, it allows me to lead with Venomoth, since I now have a backup sleep-inducer. In the latest tier trends, I saw way more Blastoise and Omastar leads than before, so it’s obviously a good matchup. Venomoth leads are quite common too, and sometimes players use them without a backup sleep-inducer, which Tangela can exploit. Abra and Poliwag leads don’t see a lot of usage, and Fire-types are still pretty popular… but I have Omastar so I’m fine. Because, yes, if you’ve noticed, Omastar also pairs well with Venomoth + Tangela. I use Blastoise lead quite a lot, but it’s usually because I don’t have room for a real lead (or let’s just say, top rank lead) and I don’t like it that much. With Tangela, I don’t have to use a suboptimal lead, and I don’t often end up in situations where I’m at a disadvantage very early in the game. Tangela also helps the paralysis spread, which Omastar, Staryu, and Nidoking really enjoy. It can annoy some paralysed Water-types (especially Omastar), can be my Slowpoke answer so that I keep my Nidoking, and it can paralyse Venomoth and Nidoqueen, which my team really enjoys. It’s also a decent answer to Scyther. With this team, I can handle pretty much anything without struggling too much, and while still having offensive tools to pressure my opponent.

    Final glance:
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Let’s now detail the movesets that I’ve chosen, discuss what could be changed, and a few more strategical things.

    [​IMG]

    - Sleep Powder
    - Psychic
    - Stun Spore
    - Double-Edge

    A standard set is standard. I use Double-Edge for Abra, Mega Drain isn’t really needed, since I already handle Water-types pretty well, and Slowpoke isn’t too much of a threat. Against Fire-type leads, I simply switch out to Omastar and I try to be careful that they don’t pivot to their own Venomoth with Fire Spin. Against Blastoise and Omastar, I have a free chance to sleep the foe; against Abra, my switch-in is Porygon; and against opposite Venemoth, I usually go to Tangela if I lose the ditto. I sometimes use Venomoth as my sleep fodder after the first few turns have passed, but sometimes I use Tangela–it usually depends on what my opponent likes to play in general.

    [​IMG]

    - Surf
    - Thunderbolt
    - Thunder Wave
    - Recover

    The main man, the star of the show. Nothing exciting here, just stick with what works.

    [​IMG]

    - Psychic
    - Thunder Wave
    - Recover
    - Hyper Beam / Thunderbolt

    Yes. Hyper Beam. Thanks to Disaster Area for suggesting Double-Edge to me; it gave me the idea to use Hyper Beam. We know Abra can be nasty at times, even if it doesn’t take a hit. I feel like I don't always need Thunderbolt that much, since I have enough to take care of Water-types (it's a tought that can obviously conflict with the Water spam tendancies). Abra can be a real nuisance, though, so that’s why I sometimes use Hyper Beam, and this is also why Porygon is my Abra switch-in. Omastar can be it too, but I don’t like using it as such, since it’s not that hard to switch into, and most of the time you’ve just allowed your foe to free hit you. Porygon can’t switch into Abra every time, though, since a critical hit or a stat drop happens fast. Why Hyper Beam over Double-Edge, you might ask? Simply because Hyper Beam OHKOes, while Double-Edge doesn’t. Of course it’s way riskier if your opponent goes to Nidoking or their own Porygon, but I personally trust myself enough to use it in a good timing. Double-Edge is fine, though, even if having to use it twice to kill Abra can be annoying sometimes. Hyper Beam makes you not need to use Thunder Wave. It also helps finishing off an opposite Porygon in some ranges after scoring a special fall, and therefore being faster. Psychic is mandatory. I switch between Hyper Beam and Thunderbolt depending on my mood and on who I play, whether they play Abra often or not. Thunderbolt is more consistent anyway. Now that I’ve revealed Hyper Beam on this team, it’s probably not gonna be useful ever again, lol. Oh well.

    [​IMG]

    - Hydro Pump
    - Blizzard
    - Seismic Toss
    - Rest

    Nothing exciting here either. I prefer Seismic Toss over Body Slam to force stuff like Blastoise and Slowpoke to Rest earlier, and I have enough tools to paralyse anyway. Body Slam is really good against Staryu, but it’s not used that much.

    [​IMG]

    - Earthquake
    - Fire Blast
    - Thunderbolt
    - Substitute

    Standard too, I use Substitute because I spread paralysis a lot, but Blizzard is fine too, since I’ve faced a bit more Dragonair than before; plus, it’s better as a last resort.

    [​IMG]

    - Sleep Powder
    - Stun Spore
    - Mega Drain
    - Growth

    Secondary sleep-inducer, status spreader… Growth is funny to utilise the Speed dropping mechanics. Mega Drain can be annoying after a few boosts.

    Venomoth
    Ability: Shield Dust
    - Sleep Powder
    - Psychic
    - Stun Spore
    - Double-Edge

    Tangela
    Ability: Chlorophyll
    - Sleep Powder
    - Mega Drain
    - Stun Spore
    - Growth

    Omastar
    Ability: Swift Swim
    - Hydro Pump
    - Blizzard
    - Seismic Toss
    - Rest

    Porygon
    Ability: Trace
    - Psychic
    - Thunder Wave
    - Recover
    - Hyper Beam

    Nidoking
    Ability: Poison Point
    - Substitute
    - Earthquake
    - Fire Blast
    - Thunderbolt

    Staryu
    Ability: Illuminate
    - Surf
    - Thunder Wave
    - Thunderbolt
    - Recover
    Conclusion
    I hope you’ve enjoyed this little book. It’s still a RMT, so I’d be happy to read what you all have to say about it, but also what you have to say about the tier in general, the changes, and if you agree with me or not at all. I know it’s not the best 4U team in the world, but it’s a team I really like, and I’ve put a lot of thoughts into it. It’s quite fun to play. Not everything goes as planned everytime, but you can play around things quite nicely. I will also add this team to the 4U sample teams thread with a link leading to here.

    Love
     
  2. Disaster Area

    Disaster Area Little Ball of Furr and Power Member

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    That was a great read.

    I think that Staryu as you pointed out, is a really great metagame pick at the moment. It works so well vs the more water-heavy teams that we're seeing a profusion of as of late. I think the team has a harder time vs Nidoqueen, since you don't really have so much in the way of checks for the nidos that the two together can wear you down; Omastar is 2HKOd and has a low chance of OHKOing Queen; Staryu only speed ties King; Venomoth is a good switch-in but it can be worn down; Tangela really only functions as a pivot / status spreader vs them, and it doesn't have much offensive presence so it can give your opponent the momentum too readily. That being said I don't think there's any real way to improve this matchup - this team is designed to be fairly anti-meta, but if double Nido becomes more popular again this team should be kept in reserve rather than tweaked.

    I'll just make a note on the different options for Normal-type moves porygon can run:
    Hyper Beam - OHKOs Abra
    Double Edge - 2HKOs Abra, Recoil, almost 3HKOs Slowpoke
    Tri-Attack - 2HKOs Abra
    I think I personally prefer Double Edge to either of the other options on this team; Omastar and Venomoth already give Slowpoke quite a bit of room, and not opting for Tbolt or Dedge maybe gives it just a bit more than I'd be comfortable with. That being said players aren't likely to set up Slowpoke in front of Porygon. It's totally preference based though, I think all 3 of those Normal-type moves can work on this team depending on individual playstyle.

    (Cool RMT name btw :p)
     
    Peasounay likes this.
  3. marcoasd

    marcoasd P.I.P. PLAY IN PEACE Host Emeritus

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    Good work for a Blastoise-less team; I feel Blastoise is just too easy to use though.
    You're relying on Staryu and Porygon to counter Blastoise, hence you need them to be unstatused (let's not talk about crits), and Abra could be an issue too.
    I think Slowpoke won't have much room, at least as long as the team is unstatused (assuming your opponent doesn't know your Porygon's moves).
     

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